The Alternative Leader Podcast
The Alternative Leader Podcast
Voice, Identity, and Leadership: A Conversation with Julia Caddick
In this episode, Voice and Presentation coach, Julia Caddick, shares her journey to leadership. Beginning with how she was enamoured by music at a young age, to following her passion through singing and performance.
Diagnosed with skin cancer when young, she found her strength and coping mechanisms highlighted in a way she hadn’t experienced before.
Julia shares with us why being able to use your voice to be authentically yourself as a leader is a skill which affects us way beyond being on stage.
We look at how self-worth can be enhanced and how it directly impacts your career path and identity.
Julia also shares with us a simple tip for how to instantly make your presentations more effective.
Julia's portfolio career includes, singing, acting, workshop leader, trainer, conductor, writer, teacher, and coach! A powerful resume which gives her a unique talent for working with anyone—from CEOs to prison inmates and countless young people—Julia is passionate about helping people fall in love with their own voice and embrace their ability to perform.
Julia now has a voice and presentation coaching and training business, where she guides executives and entrepreneurs in creating engaging, authentic presentations. Known for her dynamic, embodied, and person-centered approach, she enables clients to present with impact, confidence, and, above all, as their true selves.
Julia’s links
https://juliacaddick.co.uk
https://www.linkedin.com/in/julia-caddick-3694a234/
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCvns5lIAUKv4_waueT0r1kQ/about
Welcome to the Alternative Leader Podcast. My name is Mari Williams, and I'm the Mind Architect. I'm also founder of the Alternative Lead Academy and author of It Begins With You. This podcast is dedicated to inspiring the leaders of today to lead with intention, both in their personal and their professional lives. My guests from across the world share their challenges, their knowledge and their experiences, so that we can learn from these powerful insights to help us lead with strength, determination and compassion. Today's coach is a voice and presentation coach, Julia Caddick. Julia's journey began at the proudly unpronounceable, and I'm sure I'm going to pronounce it in the wrong way, Olchfa Comprehensive School in Swansea in South Wales. At 18, she won a place at Girton College in Cambridge to study English, but her heart led her to spend most of her time singing and performing. Since then, Julia's career has been as creative as it has been diverse. She began by teaching in two comprehensive schools in inner London, before stepping into the worlds of theatre and music. Over the years, she has built a portfolio career as a singer, an actor, a workshop leader, a trainer, a conductor, a writer, a teacher and a coach. She has a talent for working with anyone from CEOs to prison inmates and countless young people. Julia is passionate about helping people fall in love with their own voice and embrace their ability to perform. For the last three years, Julia has focused on developing her Presentation Coaching and Training, business guiding executives and entrepreneurs in engaging, authentic presentations, and she is known for being dynamic, embodying and person centred approach. She enables clients to present with impact, with confidence, and above all, as their true selves. And I've seen Julia in action, and it's quite incredible to watch the difference just from even the most basic of the tools that you teach. So thank you for coming on the podcast, Julia, and tell me where, where did you first sort of become interested in, in in the voice and speaking and performing. Do you know I have a very clear memory from when I was about I think I must have been about nine or 10, and my parents took me to a carol service for the school where my mum was teaching. And it was a really rough comprehensive school. But the weird thing about this school is, rough as it was, it had the most amazing school choir. And we went for this, for this Carol service, but we were late. The church was absolutely packed by the time we got there, and the only seats we could find were behind a pillar. And I can remember I couldn't see anything, and there were all these tall people in front of me. Suddenly this choir stood up to sing. And they were singing this piece of music by Benjamin Britten called Deo Gracias. And the piece starts with a strum on the harp, and then this choir goes Deo Gracias, Deo Gracias. And it's really exciting and very powerful, and I couldn't see anything, and I was trying to reach up to strain to see over the shoulders of people in front, and I thought the choir was singing, boom, they all can't see us, they all can't see us. And I thought, that's right, we can't see them we can't see them. But what struck me was this powerful sound, and I couldn't get over the impact it had on me and on my body of hearing this incredible sound from this choir. And I think I was hooked. That's I love, that it reminds me of Peter Kay, who talks about how people mishear song lyrics all the time and how they, you know, they kind of think it's something to do with them. I have to say, you know, very funny. But I love, I love that you were thinking they all can't see us. You're absolutely brilliant. But yes, I also resonate with that kind of, when I hear people singing it, you almost feel it in your chest, that kind of resonating, you know. I know when I go and see Les Miserable, you know, some of the songs I can, I could sort of almost feel it in my body. Yeah, yeah. So how kind of, you know, obviously, kind of age 9, you know, how did you then take, take that on? How did it end up being your career? That's a really good question. I have to say, Mari, I'm, I feel almost uncomfortable admitting this, but I'm not a person who ever planned what I was going to do with my life. I really feel like I was one of those people who went to university to do something I was really interested in, and then while I was there, things would happen, and I'd be drawn in certain directions, and I was very, sort of reactive, rather than proactive. And then something happened to me when I was at university that isn't terribly common for young people in that I got a diagnosis of cancer, of skin cancer when I was 20. And I was very, very lucky that when it was picked up, it was the early days of skin cancer in this country, and there wasn't a lot known about it. And through a sequence of incredible I was doing some voluntary work, basically in London, working on play schemes in inner city housing estates, and I'd signed up with the local GP, and they were really good this GP practice, and they they referred me to Guy's Hospital. And it was lucky that Guy's Hospital, at the time, was one of the first centres for skin cancer, and they spotted it for what it was straight away, and I got sent for treatment straight, I was so lucky. But because I then found myself in a situation where, as a young person having cancer at a time, you know, university days, when that's not what everybody else's reality is, it left me in a position where I found I had to be the calm person for the people around me. So I had to be the calm person for my parents, who were just losing it with anxiety and and I, I think I learned from that that I'm stronger than I think I am, that I have that I can be when, when, whatever it is hits the fan surprising to everybody, including myself I can be a rock and I can be I can have this calm and this ability to stay with with it and and be centred and to keep going and to have resilience. And I discovered those at that stage. And I have to say, I do feel they were gifts. They're not down to me. I think, you know, a lot of us experience this in times of crisis, and that sort of gave me this strength in difficult situations, that then carried me on. And what was the question, Mari. No no, you're, no, you're totally on point. It was kind of, you know, how did you end up doing, kind of, the voice and things? But I guess what I'm hearing is that you kind of, you know, went off. So you it's interesting because you said, I don't plan, I don't plan what I do. I'm reactive. But to me that, I mean, I think most of us don't plan I'm going to be honest, I think there's very few people I've met who said, Oh, you know, 11 I knew what I was going to be able to do and often that's a doctor or something like that, exactly. But it feels to me like what you're saying is actually that you just followed your intuition and where kind of things made you happy and gave you joy. Because, I know, obviously in the intro, I said, you oh, I kind of ended up doing music and performing rather than your degree. So do you think that you kind of followed that just kind of passion of yours? Yes, well, I think the passion has various interesting strands to it, but, but it's a fascination. I think that this, the fascination with voices, mixed with a very strong empathy for others, which I think I have, and that's what took me, first of all, to want to work with with kids who came from disadvantaged backgrounds. And then, having done that, I then realised I was working with them and doing a lot of work on voice stuff, and I gradually then felt that I I needed to get out of mainstream education and pursue it through more through an arts context. So I then went to work in in children's theatre, and then, having worked in the theatre, I also was running singing groups various places, and I started doing training workshops at that time. And for all it sounds very disparate, but the threads that started coming through was working with people and helping them with skills that they needed in the direction of voice and communication, and how you communicate with people to to get your message over the most clearly that you can. And it's so I guess I have a question here, which just sorry, just to interrupt you, is, and I love that you kind of, you know you went to work with disadvantaged children. Did you see, because I see this in my work, that actually when people's self worth or they're having a difficult time in life, they actually find it very hard to just articulate their thoughts to themselves, let alone actually then speak. And so for me, one of the things I kind of love about what you do is that, I think you know we talk about presenting, and you know work and all of these sort of things, but for me, being able to use your voice to actually speak your needs, to speak your thoughts. So I wondered whether, when you were working with children, did you see a correlation between children, almost, almost like their identity changing as they worked with you that they maybe became stronger in themselves or voiced things more. I just wondered if you saw that at all. Yes, well, it's, I think what is very interesting, I specialise when we say children, most of my work was with actually with teenagers and adolescents. And I think it's very, very interesting how people use, you know, what you sometimes hear people talk about someone having attitude. One of the things I was quite fascinated by was how what we might call attitude affects how we speak and also how self esteem plays. Even in the kind of voice you should know that whether people speak gently or whether they speak strongly, and a lot of the work that I do now, people who come to my studio may come saying, you know, well, I'm getting feedback at work that I can't always be heard. Yeah, and quite often, some of that will link back to issues to do with self esteem, issues to do with messages that we got as children or as young people about to what extent should we be heard? This is very common with women, in particular, messages when they were young, that they're too loud, or that we're hearing too much from you, you know, people who are being shut down. That's not quite a direct answer to your question, but I hope it that was good, it's interesting. I was actually sent a client a few years ago by a company who said, We think this woman could go all the way to the top, but she is so quiet that literally, at the back of the room, people can't hear her, and it's becoming a problem. Yeah, yeah. and she was. Even sitting in my room, you know, I had to, kind of, you know, no, no external noise. I had to, kind of always strain a little to hear her. Yes, she was very quiet. And it's interesting what you're saying about about the family, because when she and I talked, her family were very quiet. She just said, my family are very quiet. And we had a very open conversation about, do you want to change this? Because it is part of people's identity and who they are. And as you've said, I see it in women a lot. Yes That ability to find their voice is a struggle. But also, you know, when I work with people around presenting, I work all in the self worth and and the the childhood experiences and things so kind of, we're crossing over on that we do but absolutely, when I sorry just when, when I said to her, Do you want to change it? She didn't, because I said to her, you could go and see a voice coach, you could go and have a few sessions, and she didn't want to, which I thought was was sad, because for me she did have such potential, yeah, well, there's so much coming out of that. First of all, it's not just women. I have a lot of men who come Yeah, had feedback that their voice is is too quiet, too soft. The first thing is that you absolutely can learn to speak in a way that is slightly stronger. There are things that we can do in how we produce the voice, and I don't just mean projection. Without wanting to get too geeky about it, things to do with how we, how our voc, we use our vocal fold setup to make the sound. So for example, we all have different ways we use the voice. So Mari, if I was, if you were telling me something that was really worrying you, I might respond like this and say, you know, Mari, I'm so sorry to hear your troubles. What I wouldn't do is go, Mari, I'm so sorry to hear your troubles. Now then, they're both my voice, yeah, are different aspects of my voice. But in the second one. In this one, I'm using a thicker vocal fold setup. So it's it's very interesting what we can learn to do with our voices. And a lot of people are worried that somehow, if they go and see a voice coach or a presentation coach, that they'll be taught to perform in a way that isn't them. And what's really interesting is that we all have all these different aspects of our voices. They're all parts of us. And one of the things that I try to really remain true to when I'm working with my clients is to to work out who they are when they when they present so that so I listen really, really acutely, and I watch to see how comfortable they are and who it is that they are that's coming through it and then, and we talk a lot about their intention and their meaning and then I try and match up to help them, show them how they can do more fully what it is that they're wanting to do. So So I love that. What I hope, I hope, then we can do is help people inhabit themselves more fully, so that it's them, it's not somebody else, and it's I think people are very worried that they'll I think it particularly people who've never done much acting or anything like that in their lives, almost feel that they're being asked to be fake if they stand up and speak with a with a stronger self. But actually, what I think they're doing is tapping into who they are, and what I try and work with when I'm coaching people is I try to find out, I try to really get to the bottom of who they are and what is what is important to them, what is important, what they are passionate about in life, and then help them in how they, being true to themselves, could communicate their passion fully, but in a way that other people hear it and get the passion that they that they want to commune. It's so interesting hearing you, hearing you talk about that, because I think for me, that's exactly where I'm trying to get clients to be when they're doing it as well. For me, it comes to kind of putting, putting the self worth in place so that they don't feel, you know, judged or threatened or whatever. Obviosuly, now we all feel nervous, I think, but they don't feel sort of judged and threatened. But you're reminding me of, there was a mentee that I worked with at the judge where and, you know, I know you've started to now help and, and he was quite quiet and introvert, and he said to me, I don't think I should be the CEO of the company, because I'm very quiet and I think I, you know, I'm not the person to go out there and kind of do the big stage presentations and everything. And I said, well, actually, that's not the point. I said, on the stage, it's actually about your presence and what you're saying and your passion behind what you're talking about. And I said, actually, I think sometimes people who are kind of quieter but but fully located in their self worth and their presence actually give a bigger message than those people who are kind of out there doing all the kind of, you know, jumping up and down and music and bounciness and so that seems to be what you're saying as well and it, you know, and I like that authenticity around I am helping them step into being who they are, rather than kind of who they think they should be. That's right. And it's also not at all about who someone else thinks they ought to be. That's the key thing. That it's about, you know that we, we all have different aspects to ourselves. I mean, sometimes when I think I have realised in recent years that I'm actually an introvert, not an extrovert, but it's taken me by shock as much as anyone else, but, but I realised that I get strength by when, when I'm on my own at the end of the day and having reflective time and and I that doesn't mean I don't love company, but I can be in a situation when I'm leading training, where I can be very much, you know, what if performativeness, shall we say? I'm trying to think of a way of saying it. That's not to say that, and it isn't fake. It's true of my passion to express what it is that I want to share with the people that I'm training. But it's not the same as the me who goes home at night, makes a cup of tea and goes very, very quiet and but they're both true of me. And this is true of all of us. We have these sides of ourselves that when we want to share a passion, when we want to share something that we're interested in, and so many of the people that you work with Marianne, are people who are passionate about a business idea. Or, you know, they are entrepreneurs, or they are business executives who who have an idea that they are they believe in passionately. And I think, in a way, what we're both doing is helping people to share that passion with the rest of the world, so that the world can also take on board. What that this important idea they have to share. It's about, it's about helping people communicate that idea that they passionately believe in, that who knows, maybe that's what they've been put on this earth for. And and so what I see my role is, is helping people find how to do it in such a way that they can set their audience on fire. So what I was going to interrupt you with there was that for me, that's what I've seen in you, because I watched you give a presentation this year. And for me, the change in you as you said, not it's not the you that you know I might have coffee with or that you might be quiet at the end of the day with, what I saw was somebody who was just stepping into this is my world, this is what I love, this is the message I really want you to have. And so it's funny that you then talk about that's what you're trying to do with your clients. Yeah, absolutely, for me watching you, that's the shift I see in you. Is just this. I want everybody in this room to feel better, have a better tool to move forward in this. When I see you, when I see you doing those workshops, and I would fully recommend anybody to book you for a workshop, because it is quite transformative. You know, even I was sitting there kind of taking notes and thinking, okay, you know what about what should I do? Where can I improve? But it's funny that that's you're mirroring and modelling basically what it is that you're trying to get people to do. Thank you for saying that. Because that's, in a way, that's when I when I give a presentation, that's absolutely what my aim is. Is, my aim is to go into the room and to model absolutely everything that I'm asking people to do, well, you are spot on, on that, and just to kind of just to kind of dip back a bit. So do you think, for you as a person, having learned the skill set that you've learned, obviously, from very young forward, do you think that it has changed who you are, that ability to kind of speak in the way you want to, call it, perform, or even, even amongst friends and family, do you think it's changed you Do you know, that's such a really interesting question, and do you know, I think the thing that comes to the top of my mind when in response to your question, is the big change is that it's taught me to listen. Now, isn't that ironic that in learning to to speak and present, it's taught me how to listen and what what I do is I think, because I realise that in order to know what other people need from me. I need to know, to hear exactly what their situation is, who they are, what they need, what the context is, what they need to be able to do, so that I can help them, help other people. And I think that my my story in the communication thing is quite typical, I suspect quite a lot of women, because I came from the culture in South Wales where and I came from a family of very loud people Mari, are you surprised? Anyway, every my father was an amazing communicator, an amazing lecturer, brilliant speaker. My brother's the same, and always, I got the message that I was the one who shouldn't speak, you know. So, no, no, no leave that to your brother. Your brother can do that, you know. No, no, no, you know your dad's a brilliant teller of jokes, and he was. And it took me a while, I think, to realise that although I didn't necessarily get the affirmation in the family, where there were already very strong speakers, that actually didn't mean I couldn't do it. And I'll share with you something very personal on when my dad was on his death bed. He was he was in a terrible way, physically, and I just so wanted him to be able to return to being him again. And so one day I went in, I thought he had been the best joke teller ever, and he could really set a story up. And so I went in and I thought, you know, we don't hear many jokes as such these days do we comedy and stand up comedy's very different these days. So I went into the hospital, and I thought, I'm going to make my dad laugh today. I want to make my dad laugh. And so I told him a joke. And I thought, here I am. I'm telling a joke to the joke teller of all time and so I thought, I gotta get this right. And so I set this joke up for him, and I told him, and do you know, Mari, he laughed and he was so ill, bless him. I mean, he could barely laugh, but I suddenly realised he was shaking and laughing, and I thought it was the most wonderful moment. Yeah, I felt that I'd been empowered. I'd learnt from him anyway, but I'd been empowered to give back to him, something that he gave to so many people. And it was a big moment for me, because it took a lot of courage, because I'd always felt that I was not the joke teller, you know, no, no, no, your dad is a joke teller, or your brother's the joke teller, not you. And it was such a moment to be able to give that back to him. Yeah, that's, I think that's really beautiful story. And yes, it's that kind of full circle, isn't it? From you learning from him to then give it back, you know, as he's kind of leaving the world, and what wonderful gift to kind of make him shake with laughter. Because I actually think making people shake with laughter is actually quite hard. We can all kind of have a smile on a giggle, but making someone absolutely shake with laughter, I think, is it's an unusual skill. And I think I was just sort of listening as you've been talking, sort of reflecting. And I definitely think that for me, I certainly didn't have a voice, you know, just sort of growing up at all. And I definitely didn't have one kind of in my sort of 20s and 30s, but I was quite a loud person, so I had this kind of at the time, very extrovert, you know, always kind of centre of attention, very chatty. But I don't think I had an internal voice, and I think part of actually doing some voice coaching for me when I trained as a teacher. So I had a couple of sessions with a voice coach when I was in what I'd have been about 26 just being able to, kind of, instead of go high as women tend to go in a classroom, to just being able to hold my tone. I think that really then helped my identity. It helped me voice who I was through my speech. And so I think it's yes, interesting that linked, as you said, to identity, who who is my dad? Who are my brothers? Who am I? What's the messaging I've got about speaking? And I think, like you say, a lot of people you know, be seen and not heard, and your your comments you know on your voice isn't worth it, or you're the wrong person to do the presentation. And these things all sit with us. So it's interesting to me that so much of your work is actually about unwinding the belief system, yes, as much as teaching the vocal tools. Yeah, I love what you said there about that, the voice coaching you got when you were doing teacher training sort of helped you find your identity. Yes, and this is, you know, this is the unseen part of all this, I think, that people, and I get this kind of as feedback quite a bit when people you know that, I don't mean conscious official feedback. But you know, people say I really feel I'm finding who I can be, and I love that. That's, you know, that that just with a little bit of help, people are discovering this confidence in themselves. And so often, you know, the people, people I work with, they'll have come for one thing. There'll be one particular thing that would have sent them to me, yes, but there'll be something else that's actually going on, that, that and that you can and you recognise this, Mari from your work I know, that you suddenly realise that they have realised something about themselves, that they have said that they can say yes to about themselves, that perhaps a question they've always had. You know, should I do this? Should I do this? You know, when I speak, should I be like this? Should I be like that, or whatever? And then you when you can actually give people permission to get rid of this myth that they have to be like someone else, and they can actually be them, and to to spend time, I guess in coaching with someone who can go what you're doing, there is great, that they can get permission to, you know, this is fine. This aspect of me that I've never had the faith to believe was okay. Yep, it is okay. Not only is it okay, it backs up all these other things that have always been strong about me. But once I give this side of me permission, then the whole package gets stronger. You reminded me of a client I had a couple of years ago who came to me because they'd gone into work and had a presentation to give just a very basic kind of update, and they're in the kind of C suite level, and just panicked and left, literally walked out of the building and went for a walk. And, you know, we did lots of work around self worth and kind of life change, you know. But the interesting thing was that I remember that they sent me a message one day, a little text, just saying, I've done my first presentation since, you know, obviously a huge event, I literally left the building and I felt really at home and really comfortable and really authentic and really that around the presentation, obviously, we'd done the whole self worth piece, but around the presentation, it was, you can go and be a human on the stage. You can say, I don't know. You can say, I've forgotten what it is I'm saying. You can go and authentically be yourself. You can as ever you know you can open your presentation by saying, you know, terrible weather today, isn't it? Then actually, that that that helps you to bond with your audience. And I find often when people come to me and presentation is part of it. It's like you said, there's almost like this model that they believe, you know, I have to look like this sound like this say this on the stage, and therefore, as you said, it's this disconnect between who I am, what I'm passionate about, what I'm trying to sell you, or what I'm trying to, you know, show you, and this kind of, like you said, this fake persona. So I love it when, you know, people step into that space where they're like, I'm just gonna go and be me on stage. Yes, and, and therefore, as you said, I've noticed with that client, it's interesting that, as we put back in the self worth, but this ability to go and speak what they wanted to speak, all of their career paths changed because they were no longer thinking, I need to avoid doing a you know, job or presentations, or I avoid this, or I avoid that. So I think it's what you're doing. I think is so important for leadership, because, as you said, so many people out there have an amazing idea or amazing product or even just an amazing thought. I think we are afraid that if we are our authentic selves, that somehow we'll get in the way of our career progression. And do you know, I think this is particularly important when we're talking people who are in leadership roles where neurodivergence is a factor. Yeah, because I think neurodivergent people like myself worry a lot about how, what, what it looks like to be normal I think, I think there's a lot of people worrying about what they should be like, and should they be like other people and and it could be part of this masking yeah thing in some ways, and it's really interesting, because the number of people in senior leadership roles I've worked with who are in the neurodivergent camp, shall we say, is a large number, and who are fantastic, inspirational leaders, and yet to hear them worrying about, you know, how should I sound like this? Should I sound like that? Is quite it always fascinates me, and it's a lesson to me, because actually, when we let go that fear and start exploring our full potential of who we are with our amazing way that our brain works, and our ideas and our creativity, when we harness all of that, we become this incredible, unstoppable person of a leader. It's really interesting you say that because I think that sort of mirrors my journey, because, you know, I ended teaching because I hated standing at the front of the class, and I had a moment where I just froze. And I actually, this was the subject of my first presentation I ever did, sort of 10 years later, was telling this story. And I'm always a bit nervous. I've got less and less nervous obviously the more and more I've stood on stage, as it were, but at the beginning, you know, I was kind of gripping my key cards, and, you know, had all my, you know, and it was just like this. And over time, I've got, I've got more used to just being me on stage, not, not, you know, I might have some notes roughly in front of me, or, go over a couple of slides I forgot, or I've had, I've, you know, I've had presentations, where I've completely forgotten what I'm saying. And I've just said the audience, I've forgotten where was I? And they kind of go, Oh, you're talking about this. Or I'll say, I don't know, you know, I'll come back to you and and I think my biggest gift has been learning it's okay for me to just go out there and be my, you know, complicated self and and who I am. And the feedback I've had is you're really real. And I think we need to remember that when we are authenticlally ourselves, people say, I saw that person on stage, I like that person, rather than this kind of fake persona that you might have. And how jarring would that be if you or I were this kind of fake person on stage? And then when people came to us as clients, they were like, you're this completely different person. So that really mirrors my journey of becoming more comfortable and just saying, I mean, I think in the in the talk you saw me, I just said, you know, I'm menopausal now and I can't remember anything, because that's why I've got notes and everybody laughed, you know, because, because that's, that's the journey of many of the women in the audience. So I think that that whole piece about just be you is so important, and, and, but for me, I guess, and the reason that I wanted you to come on a podcast is, but then there is a tool set that you put on top of that that helps you be more you. So for me, the ability to control my voice and know when to go and down and all of that sort of stuff, which, that's right, you're so amazing at teaching. So I Can I just say that? I think Yes I agree there's a challenge in here too, which is, you know, when we hear people say it's really important to be your authentic self, I'm one of those people who, like many people I work with, go who is myself, who is my authentic and we need that reinforcement self, and sometimes we need that outside ear and this outside eye of someone else to go. You're this person who's like this. You're this warm bubbly. Because quite often we can't see ourselves. We don't know what we're good at. from outside to to recognise it. It's funny you say that because it's I'm remembering so, so, just for anyone listening, Julia and I happened to bookend each other, didn't we on on on a mentoring course earlier this year that we were both presenting at, and I went first, and I think you went second, and I remember walking upstairs to you afterwards and saying, how was the presentation? Or, you know, do you have any feedback or something? Because it was because it was, me to be honest, it was a bit of a cheeky, oh, I could get some free advice here, a free kind of check in on my how I'm presenting, because you're in the audience and, and I remember you just went, Oh, my God, it was amazing, or it was wonderful, whatever it was that you said. And I just felt somebody who I know knows their stuff has just told me that that was okay, and that presenting was all right, and it was just so validating, yeah, to have somebody with your skill set say to me, no, that was that was absolutely great. So I think you're right. Sometimes we just need someone to go. Well done. Brilliant. Love it. You showed up, yeah and I think, I think one of the reasons that people like coming to me, which is, I have to say, I have a kind of mixed feelings about on myself, is that I'm a little blunt, shall we say. And so so whilst, on the one hand, I think the problem with me is I can only tell the truth. So, so I, I am incredibly supportive of when things are good, but I'm also quite good at going that bit there we can work on, that one thing there we need to do this with. But, but I think you have to couch it in an acknowledgement of everything that's going right, yes, yep, yes. I think and that's actually a leadership I think that's a leadership tool. Affirmation. I'm a big believer in affirmation is such an important leadership tool. Oh, I 100% agree. But I feel like we could talk about this all day we could questions that I always ask every every guest are when you think about the challenges in your life that you've been through. Was there a book, a film or a piece of music that that you sort of regularly listened to or used to help you through that challenge? Okay, I'm not certain if it would have, because I wouldn't have known it when I was younger, but something that has increasingly in the last years become my go to emotion, an emotional experience in music that that I find helps me process so much stuff is it's an opera, and it's the opera Tosca, Puccini's Tosca. And I have to say, anyone who's ever been to the opera with me to see Tosca will know that when we get to the third act, there's going to be a lot of crying. I've tried doing it not crying. It's not possible. I love it. love that. That's so hilarious. I have those songs too. They just instantly make me cry. Yeah, The second question is kind of, what's it ,what's something that someone could do today to just help themselves get better somehow? What's the kind of tip that you would have for anyone? Okay, yes, well, okay, so I, I think what I would say is that a very, very common issue for a lot of people when they're presenting is that they talk too fast. They don't sometimes they don't actually realise they're doing it. Sometimes they do, but they feel they can't stop it. And so the the tip here is whether you are presenting too fast or whether you feel you're presenting in a way that's a bit dull. Increase your emphasis. So I just did it then increase your emphasis. If you increase your emphasis on what you're saying and keep thinking about, what is the important meaning in this sentence? What is the important meaning in this sentence, if you by increasing your emphasis, you will automatically slow yourself down, and you will automatically increase your inflection, and so you'll, it'll become much more listenable to by the audience, and therefore they will take your meaning and hear it. It'll, it'll land better. That would be mine. Lovely. I love that. That's such a simple but incredibly, incredibly effective tool. Wonderful. Okay, my third question is, if you were standing in front of the world leaders today, what would you say to them? That's really hard. I would want to say something about the importance of speaking from your heart and acknowledging the heart of the other person. So it's that sounds hopelessly wishy washy, doesn't it, but it's about acknowledging that it's all about connection between people, making a connection between people, seeing their truth, understanding who they are, and speaking to that person from your heart. Because I think that if you connect, if we all allow ourselves to connect with the people that we're meeting, whether you're an international world leader, a leader of a country, a leader of a council, a leader of a company or whatever. If we can see the humanity, acknowledge the humanity of the other person, their integrity, then everything we do in how we lead will land better with the people that we're talking to, and it will come from a better place, because we'll be considering the other I think, yeah, I think that's absolutely beautiful and so right, if we just connected heart to heart, we I think the world would be a much calmer and happier, harmonious place. So that's a really lovely note to end on. Thank you so much for coming and sharing not only your life you're welcome story, but also your kind of tips and tools. And I fully recommend to anybody to get in touch with Julia, either for, you know, workshops or one to one. I think you know, you're absolutely fantastic. I've seen you in action, and I all of your all of your links and will be in the notes that come with the podcast if anybody's trying to find you. But would you like to just tell us your web address so so you know, people don't have to search for you through the notes Yes. So it's Yeah, www.juliacaddick.co.uk, and then there's another one that you can also find me on, which is animatedpresenter.com, lovely. Oh, I love that animated presenter. That's wonderful, too. And I'll make sure that both of those go into the podcast notes, yeah, and I'm doing an awful lot of social media posting as the animated presenter at the moment. So 90 seconds, 90 seconds, cheap tip. I saw one of those the other day and shared that I thought it was a really useful little tip so again, follow Julia. Anyway, thank you so much for coming on, Julia. I really appreciate your time and your energy. You're most welcome. Thank you for having me, Mari. Hi. I'm Mari Williams, as you know, and thank you so much for listening to the Alternative Leader Podcast. I search for guests to bring you lessons and learnings that can help move you forward in your life, help you achieve the success that you want to in whatever way that shows up for you. To help you lead powerfully, whether that's in your own life, as your parenting, your personal or your professional, and make you the best that you can be. If you've enjoyed the show, please rate and review it, and please share it with as many people as you think also want to move forward and gain success in their lives. If you want to find out more about me, go over to my website, which is www.mari-williams.com, that's www.mari which is m a r i-williams.com, and you'll find links to all of my social media profiles there. There's also a Facebook community that you can join, and again, all the links will be on the website too. I hope you have an absolutely fantastic day, and thank you so much for listening.